DEBATING A TERF (Trans Exclusionary Radical Feminist)

Yes, trans women are “part of the oppressor class” today. Such a dishonest, reactionary statement

Her first point: "misogyny is the hatred of any female typical trait" is just pro trans. Transfems experience misogyny on the basis of hatred of female typical traits because they present females. So how does she exclude trans women in feminism when she also says men experience it.

terfs will look at a group of people who suffer more than they do and call them an oppressing class

okay hold up. The "trans women arent female and no leftist would disagree" is disingenuous. There's a difference between phenotypic sex and genotypic sex. HRT alters phenotypic sex but not genotypic sex, however genotypic sex only really matters in regards to development in utero for gonads, chromosomes etc.

Black women were considered not women during segregation! Gender is fluid in history

You can’t be a feminist and a transphobe at the same time you’re just a misogynist atp

At 12:20 "male supremacy came before patriarchy" is nonsensical, because saying this will mean that you belive male social superiority its biological, but then she says that is not biological, she says that there are instances of man abusing women through their sex before patriarchy, but that is also nonsensical because that abuse IS patriarchy, there is no such thing as "before patriarchy" because when a society starts to favor the male gender in an abusive way that is patriarchy

"They are not specifically being oppressed on the basis of being female"? Uhm, a trans woman who passes and lives as a woman, socially and legally, is obviously oppressed on the basis of being a woman. The feminist movement is a broad social, political, and cultural movement that seeks to achieve equality between women and men. It's concerned with womens rights, you know, the rights of people who are seen as women in society.

Terf ideology is fascist

Trans women would be intersex in biological terms, if they are transitioning medically. Giving the leeway for her on the "male"-part is kinda surrendering to the Terf ideology. Chromosomes just define what hormones and puberty you get naturally. Chromosmes are just impetus for it, but biology isnt ridgid and essentialist like dat

even before transition, most trans women are not socialized like cis men. and autism just makes that socialization worse. we are treated like a 3rd thing the majority of our lives. that we have this "inherent male supremacy" is not reflective of like any trans woman's experience.

Its really frustrated when feminism is portrayed like this. Dismantling the patriarchy is just one tenant of femenism. A principled feminist should work to dismantle ALL parallel power structures including white spremacy, cisheteronormativity, nuerotypical-normativity. Men SHOULD be included in feminism, how do we dismantle power structures without reforming the oppressor? Misogony hurts everyone, even the hyper-masculine men who dont get therapy is hurt by it. We must strive to make life better for them too. Another issue i take is that you are both classifying sex only as genotypic sex, which isnt how its classified in biology. In biology there are 5 characteristics of sex, only one of which is genotypic sex. She argued this came from judith butler, it didnt. This came from biology. If genotypic sex were the end all be all then you would struggle to classify those with xx male syndrome, xy female syndrome, androgen insensitivity syndrome, etc.

This is so ridiculous she’s saying “feminine men is getting oppressed because he’s a feminine not because he’s a woman/ or in this case, confusing the word “female” But in the same breath, she says only “females” get oppressed… Can you be any more of a blatant hypocrite?

This debate reminds me of something my history teacher used to say to me; “you can walk and chew gum, right?” Which is to say that one axis of oppression does not negate other forms of oppression. They all exist to reinforce capitalism anyways. Intersectionality ftw

I love how you get loud, but enraged. You can tell you care but can also restrain yourself to a point you may change someone’s mind.

I am a trans women. You did a horrible job with this.

I never felt right in my own body for so long and came out as trans at 21, trans women are all sister's here girl 😒🙄

"When education is not liberating, the dream of the oppressed is to become the oppressor." — Paulo Freire

FACT: Transphobia is a tool of the patriarchy.

As critique on the end part, sex based discrimination doesn't work scientifically, or medically either. For example Forrest Valkai (Literally has multiple various biological degrees) from The Line has gone over extensively on how science very much is not sex essential at all, which I could have told even with my meager bachelor's degree in biotechnology, but nowhere near to the same extent as Forrest can. On the medical side, a lot of the human body changes under HRT, let alone with the surgeries that align much closer to the female biology than it does with male. So while it remains true that the trans-woman medical experience will never be 100% identical with cis-woman medical experience, the overlap is so great that there's more benefit in treating them at OBGYN's rather than urologists in the case of sex change surgeries. But the same also applies for bloodwork lab, medication and so forth. A persons biology changes a lot when the internal chemistry is changed. So really, practically speaking, there is no need to yield ground even on scientific, biological, or medical grounds. Even within these 3 fields, it is more practical to consider trans-women as women.